Talk:Akbar/Archive 1

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Akbar stands tall among the kings who ruled India. He was the greatest of the Moguls, the Muslim dynasty that dominated India between the early 16th and 18th centuries.

Akbar was exposed to the battles and powers of rule from a young age. Akbar inherited the throne, after the sudden death of his father king Humayun, at the age of 13, in 1556. In 1579 he abolished the Jizya, a tax imposed on all but the poorest non-Muslims. This was the most notable in a series of measures to recruit the Hindu majority and others to the cause of unifying and expanding his empire. He defeated an impregnable Hindu fortress in Rajasthan and went on to marry the Rajput princess Padmini, who was permitted to conduct Hindu rites in the harem.

Akbar's religious tolerance strengthened his empire and earns him his special place in history. He is credited with innovations in textiles and artillery alike. Himself an illiterate man, perhaps because of dyslexia, he loved learning and disputation. His administrative and fiscal innovations underpinned it for a century after his death. He patronized such scholars as Birbal, Abul Fazl and Tansen. He was subject to bouts of melancholy and what were probably epileptic fits early in life. He saw these as spiritual experiences; and perhaps they gave his curiosity a religious twist.

As his reign progressed Akbar moved ever further from Islamic orthodoxy. He built a capital, Fatehpur Sikri, around the tomb of a Sufi (Islamic mystic) saint who had prophesied the birth of his heir. Later he took to inviting clerics from various religions, including Portuguese Jesuits from Goa, to debate their faiths.

Eventually, Akbar came up with his own ``religion of God, more a fraternal order, headed by himself, than a religion, based on a creed of harmony among peoples and a practice that involved making disciples of his leading nobles. Unsurprisingly, Muslim clerics saw this as blasphemy. Eventually, it became official policy to discourage, if not to prohibit, Islamic forms of prayer. Akbar paid the price in an abortive rebellion by his son, claiming to be a defender of the faith. Akbar softened towards Islam thereafter, and is thought to have died, in 1605, a Muslim, not an apostate.

His descendants, most notably, the deeply bigoted great-grandson Aurangzeb overturned the religious tolerance Akbar had established for the Mogul Government. Aurangjeb tore down Hindu temples and revived the Jijya--and a Hindu consciousness that after his death was to help pull the Mogul empire apart, weaken India, and let in the British.

References

Rizvi S.A.., The Wonder That was India -II, Rupa , 1993

National Geographic, When the Moguls Ruled, Vol 167, No 4, 1985

Schulberd L, and Editors of TIME-LIFE, Historic India, Time-Life, 1968

J.T. Wheeler, Wheeler's India, Peter Fenelon Collier, 1858 Babur Nama, The memoirs of Babur, Portfolio of 16th century miniatures, Archeological Survey of India Economist, 12/31/99, Vol. 353 Issue 8151, Millennium issue p63, 2p, 1c.

When did he defeat Hemu?

November 5 of what year did Akbar defeat Hemu??

Who says Hemu was low-caste warrior? He was a high caste Bainiya- Jain.Johnhardcastle 05:09, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Just a rehash of the 1911 Britannica entry?

Khalid B. 13:49, 2004 Jan 27 (UTC) The article at present is a rewording from the 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica. http://5.1911encyclopedia.org/A/AK/AKBAR.htm. That article says: "In religion he was at first a Mussulman, but the intolerant exclusiveness of that creed was quite foreign to his character" and "Scepticism as to the divine origin of the Koran led him to seek the true religion in an eclectic system". This wording is biased, and is typical of writings at the time when dealing with "foreign" religions or cultures.

A more realistic view is that Akbar tried to make religions live in harmony in his multi-ethnic, multi-religious realm. He established the Ibadat Khana and and held disputations between various religions (see Din-e-Ilahi), but was appalled by the animosity between the officials of each religion. The Portuguese Jesuits tried to convert him, and were not interest in a debate. The Muslim clerics were too traditional. Perhaps he was too tolerant for his time, but he was Muslim and died a Muslim never the less.

Should the article be revised? I like someone who is more familiar with Indian history to verify the above.

akbar's elephant judge/executioner

I seem to recall in an earlier version of Wiki [Crushing by elephant] [1] a reference to Akbar the Great's practice of using his favored elephant as judge for criminal trials. The defendant would place his head on a pedastal, the elephant would place it's foot on his head, some ceremony of statements, then the elephant would decide whether or not to crush the head of the prisoner. If he chose not to, the prisoner was set free. Perhaps this was removed do to historical unprovableness, but I think it is an interesting factoid. Also it would be interesting to know the name of the elephant.

viz [2] quote [...is Akbar's "Elephant Judge" story from Ein-e-Akbari or from British accounts? --Das]

Name of elephant: probably 'Kal-yug ka Hathi!' (joking). Interesting life for an elephant, probably remembered every guys face it smashed to pudding :)
hydkat 09:05, 25 February 2006 (UTC)

Life in Hell

Is the reference to a comic strip (Life in Hell) about gay rabbits appropriate in the See also section for a historical figure? It seems very strange. Ornil 04:52, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Assuming honest intentions, it was probably intended as a sort of disambiguation link to the Matt Groening comic strip character named Akbar. But there's probably a better way to disambiguate these two figures... Pinkville 16:02, 8 April 2006 (UTC)

Nine Famous Courtiers Of Akbar

Let's not get revisionist, shall we? The Persian and Urdu and, I dare say, Hindustani phrase is nau-rathan. "nava rathna" is a poor transliteration from a reverse-Sanskritization. In South Asian literature and poetry, they are referred to as "nau-rathan".iFaqeer (Talk to me!) 08:19, Feb 26, 2005 (UTC)

eating

I have read that Akbar ate one meal a day, at no fixed time, but expected a hundred dishes ready within the hour when he was ready to eat. Also, I have read that his hunting camp was larger than the London of his day. Also, why in the hell is there a See Also link to a comic strip? Is this a way to mock the greatest Mogul Emperor, who surely surpassed any king of Europe within a thousand years?

mountain crimpets?

Suzy gave him AIDS? Mountain Crimpets? Lives for a thousand years? Seems like "His Life" and "Religion" have been edited for fun I would love to help but all I have is a text book and some lecture notes.

Crimpet Religion

um...i did a little bit of fixing on the religion section... its as close to the original as i could remember, going off some notes i took in class from the _original_ article, not this messed up new one...

Last Name?

What's Akbar's last name? Here it is: Jalaluddin Muhammad Akbár

Accent Marks

I don't know who added all of the obnoxious little accent marks, but it was a pain to get rid of them. First of all, a MACRON is used to signify the long a in Persian and Urdu, not an accent égu. Secondly, I'm not sure if I should've bothered ot replace them, as neither is explicitly necessary for non-phonetic orthography. Should I just change thme to regular letters?

Dlayiga 22:10, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Most of the style guidelines suggest no accent marks (for example, Indian Cities, no accent marks, etc.) Please remove them, if you have the time! Thanks. --Nemonoman 22:30, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

No Problem.!Dlayiga 22:34, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

Guilty as charged. When I read the article they were there in some places and not others. I won't do it again! Gwaka Lumpa 12:08, 28 December 2005 (UTC)

Personality of Akbar

Hello,

This part of the article just eulogises the man, it repeats praises heaped on him by old and contemporary authors. Could someone give something more substantial with citations?
I could paste my 9'th class history textbook section on akbar.. but then you won't be able to tell the difference- its written the same way. It does have a additional bit that says his favorite hobbies were hunting with cheetas and flying pigeons... I'm serious!
hydkat 19:58, 20 February 2006 (UTC)
I hope i have added something --IndianCow 08:51, 22 February 2006 (UTC)


I have removed this paragraph, which is very POV and which cites sources of doubtful objectivity.--Nemonoman 02:25, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

It is also believed that even though he did not practice sodomy, he had allowed it to be practiced by his servants, courtiers. Accounts of the same has been also mentioned by Abdul Fazal in Ain-e-Akbari. [1] Akbar's harem was well known for his occupants. Most of them were daughters of Hindu rulers for the northern areas of Rajasthan, mainly Rajputs. He inducted the queens and daughters of abducted or killed Hindu kings and warriors into his harem. Virgins were given and entry and others were considered disqualified and were supposed work as slaves. [2]


eww! what kind of a sick twisted person would put that up in a history encyclopedia article??

hydkat 07:38, 26 February 2006 (UTC)

Reference and Notes

Please use the following style for your references...with this you have type it only once and need not have to set up the link at the bottom. Where ever you want to place the reference just copy paste format and instead of --Type the Reference Text and Link -- please type your reference text and provide external link, if available online.

<ref>--Type the Reference Text and Link --</ref>

The best example is article Khalistan--IndianCow 08:52, 22 February 2006 (UTC)

Accuracy (and Relevance) of Quote??

From the article:

Even Abul Fazl has highlighted his majesty's love for wine and women. Historians have different opinion on the text mentioned in Ain-i-Akbari. Many refer it as the mention of Emperor's care and affection to protect women, especially virgins. His administrative excellence to manage the affaris even though he had permitted wine and prostituion near the palace. However his critics does not subscribe to these views, many consider him otherwise.

".. His majesty has established a wine shop near the palace ... The prostitues of the realm collected at the shop could scarcely be counter, so large was their number .. The dancing girls used to be taken home by the courtiers. If any well known courtier wanted to have a virgin they should first have His Majesty's [Akbar's] permission. In the same way, boys prostituted themselves, and drunkeness and ignorance soon lead to bloodshed ... His Majesty [Akbar] himself called some of the prostitutes and asked them who had deprived them of their virginity?" translation of selected text from Ain-i-Akbari written by Abdul Fazal in Persian. Translated by H. Blochmann [2]

affaris == affairs?

prosituion == prostitution?

However his critics does not subscribe to these views== His critics do not subscribe to these views?

prostitues == prostitutes?

counter == counted?

soon lead to bloodshed == soon led to bloodshed?

asked them who had deprived them of their virginity? == asked them who had deprived them of their virginity. (period, not question mark?)

Can someone who has the source material verify these apparent misspellings, and either correct them, or put (sic) after them, thus indicating that the misspellings are thus in the source. Like:

The prostitues (sic) of the realm...
I apologize it was my mistake. Typo ;). Well, While typing all that stuff in a hurry.. I messed it up. Hope it looks better now. I thank Nemonoman (talk · contribs) for bringing out these errors. IndianCow 14:14, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Indian cow --Nemonoman 14:36, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

Disambig notice...

Was the Star Wars character only included because he might have been named after Akbar? I have never seen his name even misspelt this way... elvenscout742 17:33, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

Family

Was one of his son called Daniel Doctor Bruno 17:01, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, and it is spelled and pronounced "Daniyal." Please put comments at the bottom of the talk-page (not the top). ImpuMozhi 19:11, 23 July 2006 (UTC)
OK. Just learning the rules of the game. Sorry for the trouble. Doctor Bruno 13:34, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

removing Category:Polygamists

I believe adding this category is a bias. He was a Mughal Emperor, and like most ruler s in his category had a harem. Polygamy in its real sense wasn't a choice he made, it was simply the way things were. --hydkat 16:46, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

Cultural depictions of Akbar

I've started an approach that may apply to Wikipedia's Core Biography articles: creating a branching list page based on in popular culture information. I started that last year while I raised Joan of Arc to featured article when I created Cultural depictions of Joan of Arc, which has become a featured list. Recently I also created Cultural depictions of Alexander the Great out of material that had been deleted from the biography article. Since cultural references sometimes get deleted without discussion, I'd like to suggest this approach as a model for the editors here. Regards, Durova 17:16, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

vandalism

Hi. Forgive me for not knowing what I'm doing, but I want to alert more capable editors that there's been vandalism here. A subtitle should say something like "early conquests," and on the editing page it does, but on the reading page it says "suck it leah." I don't know how to fix that.

- well, maybe I've fixed it, to my surprise!

Wyote, November 58.233.70.208 17:13, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

GA Fail

I am failing this due to lack of references. The lead contains more then the body

  • still stands[2], external jump
  • Several one sentence paragraphs
  • Akbar in media - is basically a trivia section convert it from a list to a paragraph or two
  • Three citation needed tags

Try get a reference for every paragraph. M3tal H3ad 02:53, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Dis Bullshit

I be real Akbar. Akbar Abdul Mohammad Mohammad. Why dis Akbar get article and no me? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 70.52.148.49 (talk) 17:06, 25 February 2007 (UTC).

Infobox

I think we can have an infobox about the Mughal Empire/Emperors. It might help bring things into perspective.--Madhu 17:15, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Akbar's religion

It is mentioned that he founded a new religion, Dheen Ihahi. Why this article is categorized as Muslims ? --59.93.35.82 05:08, 3 April 2007 (UTC)

First Sentence

I changed the first sentence because it conveyed an implication inconsistent with the article (and common sense). The dependent clause “Though only 13 when he ascended to the throne” suggests that Akbar’s impressive reputation is surprising, given that he was made king so young. Why should this be the case? According to the previous sentence, he ruled for over 50 years. Indeed, a conjunction of “greatness” and “early ascension” would only be surprising if he had died or been deposed in adolescence. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by The blackbird is involved (talkcontribs) 17:45, 4 April 2007 (UTC).

Quick-failed

This article doesn't have enough references and there's unreferenced tag. So it should be failed on the basis of Wikipedia:Reviewing good articles#How to review an article.--Sa.vakilian(t-c) 04:04, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Akbar -> Akbar the Great

Why do you keep moving the article? It's completely pointless. number29(Talk) 06:36, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Akbar/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

has unreferenced sections plange 04:28, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

Last edited at 04:28, 30 July 2006 (UTC). Substituted at 20:13, 2 May 2016 (UTC)

  1. ^ HinduNet: Akbar's (Immoral) Character and Nature [3]
  2. ^ "Akbar the Great," Vol.1, by A.L Shrivastava published by Shiv Lal Agarwal and Co., Agra.